Friday, December 4, 2009
Guest Blogger - Katie H.
So when sitting down to start my blog I could not decide what to write. We just finished Hamlet, which I do appreciate [still not sure if I like it yet, but at least I can accept it and I will stop whining] now, and we are starting Oedipus today, which I can see being interesting. As I was studying my allusions last night, i looked ahead to see what was coming and one of them was Oedipus [Greek of course] and it said that he was the son of Laius [who we have had before] and Jocasta who abandoned Oedipus at birth because of the prophecy that Oedipus would kill Laius and marry Jocasta in the future. When Oedipus learned about the prophecy he fled from his adoptive parents and went to where his real parents were and the prophecy came true. And of course we all [should] know what happens in Hamlet. As I am writing this I can’t help but wonder if Grecian tragedies have the same elements as Shakespearean tragedies. Grecian tragedies are slightly different, the tragic hero does not have to die but it was very common and they were not in trouble just because of mistake that they themselves made, it was also because of the fate of the gods (http://faculty.gvsu.edu/websterm/Tragedy.htm). The thing that I expected to be vastly different in Grecian tragedies was the meter and rhythm that they were written, but Aristotle mentions that everything must have “appropriate language” for the context (http://faculty.gvsu.edu/websterm/Tragedy.htm). Aristotle also stated that tragedies are “a more philosophical and serious business than history; for poetry speaks more of universals, history of particulars" (http://faculty.gvsu.edu/websterm/Tragedy.htm). In my opinion that makes it seem that a tragedy must be completely fiction like Harry Potter or something, which has no reference to the history of the time, but Hamlet even had references to things that were common during those days. Well, I think that I’m going to be done for now. Bye!!!!
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I think that the quote by Aristotle means that the ideas spoken of in poetry will apply to all peoples throughout the ages -- poetry ought to be timeless. History, on the other hand, can only tell you what specifically happened at a certain time and is limited in the aspect that it cannot draw any general conclusions about humanity.
ReplyDeleteBefore I say anything, could you please change all instances of "Grecian" to "Greek", it really annoys me, thanks.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, the thing that caught my eye was that you mentioned these plays are usually comprised of the fate of the gods (http://faculty.gvsu.edu/websterm/Tragedy.htm). The actual quote says "fate, and the will of the gods", and the "and" in that quote poses a question. Do the Gods control fate in these plays? Imagine if that were the truth. Then the whole tragedy of Oedipus would be the result of the Gods basically acting as puppeteers of human life. Oedipus would not really be to blame, nor his father because it would have all been orchestrated that way. This is why it is important if there is a separation between fate and the gods. Unfortunately, even if fate does determine everything in the play, it is still a tragedy. With only fate, the blame falls to the father, Laius, who chose this fate from a mistake he made in the past.
Still, if anyone would like to continue this discussion in further posts I would be alright, unless you decide to constantly agree with me and not present anything new.
The way I see it, if a person controls his own fate, then fate is just the natural consequences of each action. If it is not a natural consequence, then it has to be controlled by another power (the gods). In Oedipus it is assumed that Oedipus's fate is the result of bad choice that Laius made in the past. Oedipus killing his father and marrying his mother is not a natural consequence of Laius's mistake. This means that Oedipus's fate had to be controlled by the gods.
ReplyDeleteI get the whole "children feel the effects of parents bad choices," but I guess what bothers me is that why should the child be punished as well? I mean couldn't the gods simply kill the parent? Death seems punishment enough if you ask me. But I suppose with out carry over of punishment, literature wouldn't be very interesting would it?
ReplyDeletethis doesnt count as one of my comments, but will just so you know i do not have the power to make the changes you want me to, sorry. and i didnt know that was wrong.
ReplyDeleteI must say that although Greek and Shakespearian tragedies have many of the same tragic elements to them, I find Greek tragedies harder to identify whether or not the play is actually a tragedy. I guess in a way I thought that because the play is Shakespeare, it has to be tragic were as when I started reading Oedipus I honestly could not tell, even though towards the end it was obvious ( after understanding what a tragedy consists of). Even though it is harder for me to identify tragic elements in Greek plays, I would rather read a Greek play then a Shakespearian play mainly because I do not care for the super natural things he puts into them . I like Greek plays because the super natural part was more about Greek gods and Greek mythology which I find really interesting and I really do like reading more into how they actually play in to real Greek culture.
ReplyDeleteAlthought they are very alike, one big difference between Greek and Shakespearean tragedies is that Greek tragedies contain a chorus.. which serves as a huge part of the play.
ReplyDelete